ADAT to Analog Converter

[Phillip W. Palmer]

Not looking to immediately use this feature, but have started to think about it. The idea of having additional analog I/O is interesting to me.

I know RL has an outboard ADAT A/D converter in his upper wireless rack. Is it an Alesis AI3? How does it handle the signal if the O1V is pulled up to 48.048?

There is a simple ADAT to Analog output unit by Aphex called the 141, but it has no word clock. Wondering the same about it. It's a half rack space with a DSUB for output.

www.aphex.com/141.htm

Also a unit by Behringer, though I'm always suspect, with 8 channels of I/O. And another by Presonus, which actually has word clock.

www.behringer.com/EN/Products/ADA8000.aspx

www.presonus.com/products/Detail.aspx?ProductId=13

Anyone use any of these devices and how do they handle the pull up? Thanks.

[rlightstone]

The Alesis AI-3 is discontinued, replaced with the AI-4, which has a word clock input. However in regards to how the AI-3 handles 48.048, here is the answer from the manual, referring to the ADAT In and Out connections:
"When digital clock is coming into the AI-3’s digital input, it automatically slaves to this clock source. If you only connect the digital output of the AI-3 to another product, such as a mixer or recorder, then the AI-3 has to be the master clock."

I route my ADAT OUT of the 01V IN to the Fireface 400 and OUT of the FF400 IN to the Alesis AI-3, OUT of the AI-3 IN to the 01V.

I use the FF400 as the Master clock to drive the Yamaha and Boom Recorder at 48.048. The Alesis slaves to that clock rate as the Yamaha does. I have not heard any clocking issues in either the digital or in the analog out of the Alesis.

But, I am thinking of finding a more elegant unit, that I can use the analog outs for EPK, video assist etc. (The answer is in my next sentence...)

I could use the Fireface 400 Analog Line outputs 1 - 6 and if needed 7 and 8 are Phone Out.
My EPK and Video Assist audio out needs are minimal, which is my Comp Mix on Bus 1 and Bus 2.

RL

[Phillip W. Palmer]

Thanks Richard. I think you helped me answer my own questions with the Aphex as well. I looked at the online manual and it said:

The Anaconda system is designed to work at 48kHz sampling frequency only. In order to achieve its unmatched performance, the clock must be within +/-5Hz of 48kHz.....

...The Model 141 needs no clock as it converts whatever is on the ADAT input to analog. It can accept 44.1kHz or 48kHz.

I read this as it will probably be fine with the pulled up 48.048 sample rate. A test would be nice, and I'll see if I can come up with one.

This would be a very simple and easy way to have 8 additional outputs for the reasons RL mentioned, as well as the various cueing and playback situations I keep running into. Two auxiliaries on the OMNI 3 and 4 might not be enough for me on occasion. Just thinking ahead.

[darren]

Yes, that is what I was thinking too. Pretty much any interface that has ADAT can be used as a convertor, in either direction. Both my traveler and my 2882, and pretty much any other device out there will run at 48.048 when clocked to it without issues. One nice thing about Richard's interface, and the rest of that brand is that they can be set to generate 48.048, as well as slave to it.

[rlightstone]

Just to be clear when I am using the Fireface 400 as a master word clock for 48.048. I connect the Word Clock OUT of the FF400 to the Yamaha's Word Clock IN.

In the DIO/SETUP menu, I select the box WC IN. The Yamaha should now clock successfully to this source and all your slot I/O boxes should be come clear (no X's) that means everything is "talking" to each other. I refer to it as "No clicks, No runs, No Errors"

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[rlightstone]

Here is a "guide" to what the DIO Slot or ADAT boxes look like, depending on a signal or not...
Phil I wish we could attach more than one photo in a post without having to upload photos to another online site and then tag to it.

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[Phillip W. Palmer]

Thanks Richard. I just went and had a look at the way I've got my DEVA set up using the MY16AE card and feeding WC from the DEVA to the WC in on the Yamaha. All seems to be just as you stated for a "No clicks, No runs, No errors" set up.

For the ADAT output to converter, it seems that all the devices on the end of the chain use the sync that runs with the output of the ADAT, or simply they output whatever is on the light pipe. Which is quite useful in the addition of outputs as necessary.

Regarding the multiple images. Yes, it is a limitation of this board if you use the "attachment" function. But if you really need to add multiple images, you can do so via the html script and link from Flikr, Photobucket, or whatever. I've done it and it works fine. I actually don't mind the multiple posts at all. Your contributions are very valuable and helpful. Thanks so much.

[rick]

I'm giving the ADAT out from the O1V a try so I picked up a Behringer ADA 8000 to use as an interface.
I'll use the eight xlr outs to feed a DV824.
I noticed when I fed -20 tone from the O1V to the ADA 8000 I see -30 on the DV824.
I suppose this could be a prosumer box, hence the apparent -10 loss.
Maybe a MOTU Traveler or a fancy box from RME is what I need.
Hmmm.
RM

[Phillip W. Palmer]

Jun 13, 2010 0:44:54 GMT -5 rick said:

I'm giving the ADAT out from the O1V a try so I picked up a Behringer ADA 8000 to use as an interface.
I'll use the eight xlr outs to feed a DV824.
I noticed when I fed -20 tone from the O1V to the ADA 8000 I see -30 on the DV824.
I suppose this could be a prosumer box, hence the apparent -10 loss.
Maybe a MOTU Traveler or a fancy box from RME is what I need.
Hmmm.
RM

Sorry took so long to respond to this Rick. Weekend and all...

I don't think it's a pro-sumer vs. professional, -10db vs. +4db issue. As I know it, the ADAT output is the same as the AES and SPDIF outputs in that it is giving exactly what the console is delivering. So the source needs to be addressed. You have the ability to decrease outputs on the console, so you should look there to see if everything is full up. Tones must be set to different levels as well, so give a look there.

Anyone else have a clue on this??

[rlightstone]

Rick,
Are you feeding the return signal from the DV824 back to the 01V?
If you were then you could see what the level of your -20dB tone was and also do a playback and see if it all lined up correctly.

It could just be a difference in the way the meters read your signal.

RL

[Phillip W. Palmer]

Considering adding the Fireface 400 to my rig for several reasons. Additional line inputs for more wireless, leaving the mic pre's open on the console. 8 more line outputs for the expansion of a DEVA 16...haven't gone there yet, but want to be able to.

This unit seems to fit the bill quite nicely and as RL reports, it's very useful. Anyone else use the 400 or 800? As I understand it, it can be set up and left as stand alone, without having to leave it hosted by a computer. Confirmation of this would be great, thanks.

[rlightstone]

Yes, as the manual says:
"The function Store in Flash Memory (Settings dialog) and Flash current mixer state (TotalMix) allow to store the current settings into the Fireface 400. The unit then remembers all settings, and loads these automatically when switched on. With this, the Fireface 400 can be used standalone after setting it up accordingly, replacing lots of dedicated devices"

In the "Fireface Settings" window (on your mac) - where you set the sampling rate etc -- at the bottom right is button called "store" which will store the current settings to the RME's flash memory - so it will be at that state on power on (unless you change it, natch).
Here is the link to the FF400 Manual www.rme-audio.de/download/fface400_e.pdf

RL

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[Phillip W. Palmer]

After some more thought and comparison, I'm starting to consider a different option for my ADAT to analog conversion. The Fireface 400 allows for only 6 channels of balanced output, with channels 7 and 8 unbalanced and accessible only from the front panel MONITOR output. I would like to have 8 channels of balanced audio output.

This brings me to a different choice. Right now I'm considering the MOTU Traveler or the Metric Halo 2882 Mobile I/O. I'm leaning toward the MH 2882 as it seems to me more purpose built for exactly what I'm trying to accomplish. Though the price is a bit steep, compared with the other options.

In short, I'm trying to add 8 more channels of analog output using my ADAT light pipe for 8 channels of analog input into a DEVA 16. Also adding 8 channels of line input via ADAT light pipe into the Yamaha O1V96. This is for additional wireless, music, etc.

Anyone using either one of these devices with some advice would be very helpful. Thank you!

PWP

[Phillip W. Palmer]

An update on this thread and upgrade plan. I have discovered, in a very expensive fashion, that the Metric Halo 2882 Mobile I/O doesn't like to work in a stand alone fashion. It needs to be hosted by a computer/laptop. It works in my set up, except for this very important requirement. I'm sad to report that I will need to go to something less elegant and more simple, such as the AI3. The Alesis AI3, as RL has pointed out, is a simple ADAT to analog 8x8 converter. Though it's a discontinued item, I found one on ebay for a good price.

Sadly my barely opened MH 2882 is now up on ebay as a new/opened box.

PWP

[tourtelot]

FWIW, I too use the AI3 and it does it's job perfectly. I use it from the ADAT out of the 01V96 for all my communications outputs. Can't see any reason that an inexpensive D to A would be any problem feeding Comteks or Lectro IFB, Time code to a playback, or EPK feeds.

I had a Presonus DigiMax FS in there for a while, but took it out to use the mic preamps elsewhere.

I have better preamps now and it will be going on eBay as soon as I wrap my current series. Let me know via PM if anyone might want it before it goes up:)

D